Fantasy Attic

Program Help Section => Bryce-D|S-Blender-Carrara-Hexagon-Vue-Wings3D-C4D => Wings3D => Topic started by: Aelin on February 05, 2017, 05:06:20 PM

Title: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Aelin on February 05, 2017, 05:06:20 PM
Or more exactly the top of a corinthian column. Something like this
(https://www.sharecg.com/images/medium/119778.jpg)

I looked a large part of afternoon to find a video or a writted tutorial, and I found nothing except already made columns.
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: mtdana on February 06, 2017, 12:47:26 PM
You want to make a column this this? There are many pieces, I think for the details on the top I would use a reference drawing. This may give you some more ideas on how to start Aelin. https: //www.youtube.com/watch?v=rOHbg2L1Igg&index=4&list=PLP3-5QSIC-VcsndQX3HR1hGDFwDbpcOXh
 :toast:


Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Aelin on February 06, 2017, 01:19:18 PM
Thank you for the link. Alas it don't work for me; each time I put it in the url bar, I end on google :shock: Don't ask why, because I have no clue myself.
Taking only a part of url to start a search by google, I end on this chain: VscorpianC (https://www.youtube.com/user/vscorpianc/videos)
Is it this?
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: mtdana on February 06, 2017, 01:22:40 PM
Does the same for me - there is a space after https lol - try it again


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rOHbg2L1Igg&index=4&list=PLP3-5QSIC-VcsndQX3HR1hGDFwDbpcOXh
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Aelin on February 06, 2017, 02:08:00 PM
Good point! I haven't seen the space  :toast:
I was afraid one day I must try this 2D toward 3D way. Too much for tonight :psycho: I will prepare my mind for this.

 :ty01: for the idea.
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: thelufias on February 06, 2017, 02:21:19 PM
Neat Tut........
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: mtdana on February 06, 2017, 02:22:26 PM
Good point! I haven't seen the space  :toast:
I was afraid one day I must try this 2D toward 3D way. Too much for tonight :psycho: I will prepare my mind for this.

 :ty01: for the idea.




LOL, I don't think there is an easier way - you'll be up for the challenge in the morning! :Hi5:



Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: mtdana on February 06, 2017, 04:26:10 PM
Neat Tut........


TL, Here's another Neat Tut

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bl4ngBPIRVI

Hey Aelin, Using Mirror will either cut the work in half or get you in trouble twice as fast Lol!  :yeow:
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: thelufias on February 06, 2017, 04:35:03 PM
Very interesting.......... :toast:
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: mtdana on February 06, 2017, 05:14:40 PM
Or more exactly the top of a corinthian column. Something like this
(https://www.sharecg.com/images/medium/119778.jpg)

I looked a large part of afternoon to find a video or a writted tutorial, and I found nothing except already made columns.


I got curious and wanted to see how a column's wireframe was constructed, found the one in your picture. It didn't load into wings3d but does with DS, changed the preview to shaded wireframe. There is an amazing amount of detail, he probably made it in pieces then replicated and grouped them. That would also make the UV mapping easier. It's a super high quality mesh, not what you normally see - you got a good eye zero in on this one.  :yes:     



Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Madbat on February 06, 2017, 05:42:05 PM
Holy moly that's a complex  bit of modeling.
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Aelin on February 07, 2017, 09:15:27 AM
Yep, I guess he is to another level of skill!
I'm trying to take only a detail (3 'palms') on a photo, but I'm not sure if I could go until the end.
What I discovered today, it's we can add (an)other point(s) on one side only, if we need to add one in more in the way of video :hypno: I'm afraid anyway this tuto is easier with simple props like weapons. But it's good to continue until the end to have the last word of story.
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Aelin on February 07, 2017, 02:47:23 PM
After one hour to do the turn of interesting palm (because suddenly x went to right in place of left, and inversely :hypno: ) I obtained a not bad at all shape. But it's all. After I can't continue with holes and curves of palm :shock:
So my only way is to look like you the frame of other column :panic: That is a lot of faces, mainly tri-faces.
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Jherrith on February 07, 2017, 07:09:32 PM
Not enough :sake:
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: mtdana on February 08, 2017, 01:39:13 AM
Not enough :sake:


:yes:
but when it all makes sense you have had way too much :sake: :sake: :sake: :odd:
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: mtdana on February 08, 2017, 01:53:34 AM
After one hour to do the turn of interesting palm (because suddenly x went to right in place of left, and inversely :hypno: ) I obtained a not bad at all shape. But it's all. After I can't continue with holes and curves of palm :shock:
So my only way is to look like you the frame of other column :panic: That is a lot of faces, mainly tri-faces.


The base should be much easier to handle, unless you take J's advice :sake:  Lol!!
You wouldn't model the tri-faces, that can be added on export. I tried again and the Column model does load into wings3d if you wait long enough, I separated just the top part and it is made up of 714 separate pieces!!! :fainting: This is crazy stuff - lol!
 
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Aelin on February 08, 2017, 04:12:26 AM
:panic:
No, I prefer quads indeed. But just the stalk for one palm is a pain. After a night of rest, now W3d decides if I continue to "sweep" that X=Z and conversely :shock:

In place of :sake: I prefer (http://thefantasiesattic.net/attic/Smileys/default/chocolates.gif)
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: mtdana on February 09, 2017, 02:10:47 AM
No, I prefer quads indeed. But just the stalk for one palm is a pain. After a night of rest, now W3d decides if I continue to "sweep" that X=Z and conversely :shock:


Hi Aelin, I hope Wings is behaving better! Here is another approach I tried after watching these tutorials


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DJ-icSE6YLE


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XhVVOXYvc4M


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oLqlHS_vAAA


The pictures lists the commands I used. Bend was quite easy after several tries, the first bend was the entire cone and a second bend was just the top. The Bend command only appears when points are selected.


Put On was a little harder to get right. Select a face on the object to clone then open the context menu and start Put On with a right click. Select 3 faces on the trunk and then execute put on with a right click. Turn the branch 180 and move, then repeat. I first tried to put on all six branches but the three on the opposite side of the truck were upside down - I don't know why :)  There is another benefit to cloning, if you UV map the object to be cloned, then all the clones will share the same UV map. At the end you can combine all the pieces into object. I hope this gives you some more ideas, have a great day!!!


   


       





Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Jherrith on February 09, 2017, 06:19:43 AM

:yes:
but when it all makes sense you have had way too much :sake: :sake: :sake: :odd:

Very probably
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Aelin on February 09, 2017, 07:12:30 AM
 :yeow: Cones... I have totally forgotten their existence :shock:
Yeah, I learnt the other day to bend thanks to the first video  :toast: He is a great teacher, 'cause it's him who has videos for "the dock".
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: mtdana on February 09, 2017, 10:25:41 AM
:yeow: Cones... I have totally forgotten their existence :shock:
Yeah, I learnt the other day to bend thanks to the first video  :toast: He is a great teacher, 'cause it's him who has videos for "the dock".
I want to watch his other videos :)
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Aelin on February 09, 2017, 10:38:08 AM
Don't hesitate, we have 13 links of his videos in Urban modelization (http://thefantasiesattic.net/attic/index.php?topic=16142.0)
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Aelin on February 15, 2017, 11:55:58 AM
Bend things is good for me. But bridge between 2 bended things is not really good.
I don't talk to do "leaves" for the Corinthian capital :OMG: I tried again this morning, diverting the tuto for the gun to create a "shape" of leaf; it was horrible, and impossible to add 2 on the bended part with success, because they were one in the other in a :panic: way.

So I believe I'll try only to add a texture for this time. Alas flat columns on teh top, but it's the better thing to do.
Maybe a play with bump or displacement black/grey/white could help on this. I'll see.

 :ty01: again for your help!
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: mtdana on February 15, 2017, 02:43:08 PM
Not sure I understand, maybe if you post a screenshot. IDid you try the put on command? Always many ways to things but only some work :)
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Aelin on March 02, 2017, 02:32:28 PM
Sorry for the later answer. When I posted my previous message, I had already removed my W3D saved files.
I have always not the "click" to do the sculpture correctly. I have things around columns, and for the moment I try to find brushes approchaing for them. But alone I found are in .ai and I haven't Illustrator :psycho: :shock: :thud: So I must take shapes of ornaments, then created by myself the brushes.
On a good note, I found also brushes in relations with corinthian capitales. Maybe I can improve my first texture for this one.
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Aelin on December 10, 2017, 04:02:19 PM
Finally I was back to follow the "gun tutorial" for another shape, less complicated.
I'm not sure I'll be able to do a corinthian capital, but I'll have maybe a better approach.
Specially like I have understood I missed the orthogonal view previously :rouge:
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: mtdana on December 10, 2017, 04:11:29 PM
Also she is in tweak mode, not sure the tut was clear about that. Good luck  :lite2:
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Aelin on December 10, 2017, 04:43:41 PM
And no minions to eat it? lol

I'm pretty sure this time I'll be able to do the shape around. It's inside that is a big "?".

I'm not in Tweak mode no, but I saw she has a different way to move points compared to me indeed.
I prefer for the moment the move X, move Y like I do, even if it takes more time. I'm forced to keep my concentration.
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: mtdana on December 10, 2017, 05:51:05 PM
A banana, at least you could identify it! Normally what I make can't be lol


Aelin, Tweak will let you move a group of point at the same time and it is similar to sculpt mode which you have used, so I don't think it would take long for you to lean it.
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Aelin on December 11, 2017, 04:40:42 PM
Even without Tweak it's possible to move several points. Either when you cut a line in several parts, you keep points in red and you make the job. Or selecting those which interest you.
Maybe less intuitive, but concentration always  :shrug: lol

I'm in the phase of create lines inside.

But I must admit I have some edges which are there but not always possible to see :hypno: Sometimes when I move a little a point it's ok to show again an edge, but the neighbor edge can do the same trick suddenly :hypno:
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: heddheld on December 11, 2017, 05:02:52 PM

saw this earlier hun ........but blender and wings have gone dif ways
so think of this as ideas not dyed in the wool ways ok
the way I'd try this in blender is dif to the way I'd try in Hex
and I never tried anything this hard in wings


in blender I can mirror over x and y ........eg I only worry about 1/4 of the mesh
{is other things like rotate a part to make something with more then 4 sides :hint: lol }
make parts as separate meshes ...........but EXPORT as one mesh ..poser don't care
not 100% wings can do that but pretty sure it will
so u make a leaf.....or a scroll.........then you repeat them as often as u like ....
the tut your looking at is good BUT don't do all outline in points
do in squares !! .....yeah anno is it two or more .....well u decide
start at thin end an keep em similar


is a good thread at BA {blender artists}  shows how to do this stuff ...is u cant find it yell
will help
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Aelin on December 11, 2017, 05:27:28 PM
I tried by separate stuff, but result was... well impossible to name it, but it wasn't something like a banana for sure :psycho:

My intention is already to do a face, then to see what happens. I don't want to do a 100% identical, or details with be killed!
I will use mainly cut for edges, then extrusion. Probably bevel tool for few parts. And at the end smooth on several parts.
It's all that I think for tonight. But brain starts to be ko  :shrug:
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: heddheld on December 11, 2017, 06:40:02 PM

will assume here you can make other parts of column ??
cos if not your really starting with hard part


cant see pics in reply ( ? is that normal?? win 10 updated )


sorta pull it apart


in blender I make them leaves with Bezier curves then fill with quads
 (making sure I have edge loops )
then add a solidifier to give it thickness
then a subD to soften edges {probably more edge loops to keep shape )
then I deform to get bent shape
then dup/rotate to spin it round column
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Aelin on December 12, 2017, 06:58:52 AM
Thoerically I can do the rest of column without problem yes. Except if amnesia comes suddenly :psycho:

Blender seems always a world far away for the moment :hypno:

If you try to see pics when you are responding, in messages below, yes nobody can see them. You must open another tab to answer, and to continue to see the topics with pics, videos, other possible attached files...
It took time before I noticed that, then how to do.
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: mtdana on December 12, 2017, 10:13:17 AM
Thoerically I can do the rest of column without problem yes. Except if amnesia comes suddenly :psycho:


Or unless wings get haunted :thud:
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Aelin on December 20, 2017, 10:00:06 AM
Fortunately, not yet!  :(ROFLMAO:

I ended the shape around.
Then came the moment to draw everything inside. How to do? I cut vertically in 2 parts in the middle, like you saw the last time.
Then I had to create a new point on the 'bottom' line, and rely it to another in the 'top' shapes. Cut the new line with a lot of points, to do like for the shape around, like it's shown in the video for the gun.
But in the middle it's different. Because after a time you need to remove a part of the lines, to connect some points with others.
Brief, ok maybe I do more complicated than in Blender, but I continue to learn a lot with Wings.

And now, I'm just after the extrusion.
Colors are just to see where I go with each parts.
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: mtdana on December 20, 2017, 10:42:11 AM
Great progress - looks good!!! :lite2:
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: heddheld on December 20, 2017, 01:12:40 PM

hard to explain but


make top face
then make next face DOWN an on etc
then change heights on each set of faces
then JOIN up/down
good idea to have same number of points on every level !!


as you are doing using lines ..........use squares instead
extrude one end .........move points to profile
when it gets too wide /complicated add an edge loop an carry on with 2 squares
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: Aelin on December 20, 2017, 01:35:06 PM
Problem now is to have squares it's hard to have for the moment.
I know on another 2D toward 3D object I tried I was able finally to obtain a lot of squares - it's not a pretty object, just my real first test. Here, it will be very hard - I obtain more "stars" lines. I know to export after it's better to have squares, but probably I won't have them.

I haven't really ended to 'sculpt' that face, so I must end that.
Like it's not symmetric, I don't think to join faces will be do like that. Probably I'll use a little square, then "intrude" the back face to have a more little part. Then bridge all to the square.
Title: Re: Make a corinthian column?
Post by: heddheld on December 20, 2017, 02:43:09 PM

oh hun .......is a thread on BA about this type of modelling


I know you have the patience ......but is maybe the worst(hardest) kind of modelling
doing a sculpt [then retoppo ] is maybe easier


best I can say is look at pic head on
pick the strong edges
make each shape as a one off mesh
adjust z (height) of each shape
now join with edge loops